Vietnam & VETS



Although not specifically addressing Submarines (my primary focus here and the area of experience I have in my background), I did devote almost five years to that little conflict. I am a Cold Warrior and Viet Nam was simply a hot spot in that war. IMHO, also the Cold War never ended and today Russia is ascending and the USA is in decline (recall the decline of Great Britain after WWII – I contend the Germans won WWII and now are the powerhouse of Europe – Great Britain lost their worldwide empire because Germany forced them to spend massive amounts of national treasure and simultaneously grow a Socialist state).

My service in that theater spanned the period 1968-1972 (the heart of the conflict) and my service was in the USS Joseph Strauss (DDG 16). I hold two Combat Action Ribbons and the ship received a Navy Commendation Medal and a Presidential Unit Commendation for action during the period. I choose to enter the surface Navy out of NAVOCS in 1968 because I had been in the Nuclear Power program or studying Electrical Engineering for over eight years and did not want to “sit out” Viet Nam in a submarine . It was the only war we had and being full of “piss and vinegar” I went for the experience and service to the nation. As a consequence of the many months on the gun line off the coast I was awarded a disability for massive hearing loss three years ago by the VA.

I spent minimal time “in country” but was headed to the “Brown Water Navy” hen I received orders to MIT in 1972……I would have gladly gone but “luck” sent me elsewhere.

I highly recommend an excellent book by James LaBaume (retired University Professor and ex-Marine) entitled “The Betrayed: On Warriors, Cowboys and other Misfits” which examines the predominant feelings of ALL Viet Vets even today (2013). Looking at the current huge divide in this nation as manifested by the massive debt and entitlement programs the soul of this nation is diseased and we are paying a massive price accordingly.

The below is quoted from LaBaume book and precisely reflects my feelings and the feelings of most Viet Vets today:

“WHAT MAKES US DIFFERENT? No doubt, the Viet Nam era was one of the worse periods in our history. The general consensue is that The War of Yankee Aggression was our most terrible time and in a lot of ways it was. But , it di not change the fabric of our society the way Viet Nam did.
Most of us Southerners hated Yankees before the war, hated them while it was going on, continued to hate then through reconstruction, and still hate the bastards to this day. In other words the war did not change our attitudes toward each other very much.
Vietnam was different in that it coincided with a revolution at home and, between the two created a huge chasm in our society.
Years later one of my university students asked me, ‘What is it about you Vietnam vets that makes you so different from other veterans?’
It has nothing what so ever to do with what happened there (ALL wars are traumatic and drastically change people).
No, it is what happened to us here.

Years afterward I learned that I represent only 40% of a generation – those of us who went as opposed to those of us who did not. As Robert Timberg points out in “The Nightingale’s Song” there is a huge chasm between those two portions of this generation. It will likely be closed only when the last one of us is dead.

How could it be any other way when you consider the facts? For example between 1964 and 1973 sixteen million or 60% of the 27 million men to come of draft age, escaped military service through an elaborate structure of deferments, exemptions, legal technicalities, and noncombat military alternatives, for example the reserves where George Bush escaped it.


I may slap the next son of a bitch that says to me “I wish I could have gone, but…..’. Hey the thing lasted 10 years. If you missed it you had to have wanted to miss it.

Where are that 16 million today ?? They are senators and congressmen, business leaders, public administrators, university professors and school teachers.

One became vice-president . Then there is the most famous anti-war protester and draft dodger of them all, Bill (Slick Willie) Clinton.”

LaBaume puts it well. He did not mention the Amnesty extended to the Draft Dodgers that fled their nation and after the war was over begged to come home to mommy. Amazing that Ford actually did this….truly amazing. And today we have a weak President with no military experience surrounded by people who dodged the draft and espouse radical anti-American philosophy. It is entirely possible the American people in 2016 will put in office “Slick’s” spouse……the lawyer that defended the Black Panthers and was Secretary of State responsible for the deaths of patriots in Benghazi. The nation has lost its soul and will pay heavily for the loss of character and integrity in the near future. Vietnam veterans well understand what happened………but few Boomer Draft Dodgers and whelps thereof really care… gas (paid for with veteran blood in the Middle East) and cheap Chinese goods keep the Sheep content…..for now.

From the New York Times, 22 FEB 2015:
CREDIT Matt Richtel……PP author and reporter NYT:

VETERANS Lamentation
HUNTER GARTH was in a gunfight for his life — and about to lose.
He and seven other Marines were huddled in a mud hut, their only refuge after they walked into an ambush in Trek Nawa, a Taliban stronghold in Afghanistan. Down to his last 15 bullets, one buddy already terribly wounded, Mr. Garth pulled off his helmet, smoked a cheap Afghan cigarette, and “came to terms with what was happening.”
“I’m going to die here with my best friends,” he recalled thinking.
I didn’t know any of this — nor the remarkable story of his survival that day — when I met him two months ago in Colorado while reporting for an article about the marijuana industry, for which Mr. Garth and his company provide security. But I did know he was a vet and so I did what seemed natural: I thanked him for his service.
“No problem,” he said.
It wasn’t true. There was a problem. I could see it from the way he looked down. And I could see it on the faces of some of the other vets who work with Mr. Garth when I thanked them too. What gives, I asked? Who doesn’t want to be thanked for their military service?
Many people, it turns out. Mike Freedman, a Green Beret, calls it the “thank you for your service phenomenon.” To some recent vets — by no stretch all of them — the thanks comes across as shallow, disconnected, a reflexive offering from people who, while meaning well, have no clue what soldiers did over there or what motivated them to go, and who would never have gone themselves nor sent their own sons and daughters.
To these vets, thanking soldiers for their service symbolizes the ease of sending a volunteer army to wage war at great distance — physically, spiritually, economically. It raises questions of the meaning of patriotism, shared purpose and, pointedly, what you’re supposed to say to those who put their lives on the line and are uncomfortable about being thanked for it.
Mr. Garth, 26, said that when he gets thanked it can feel self-serving for the thankers, suggesting that he did it for them, and that they somehow understand the sacrifice, night terrors, feelings of loss and bewilderment. Or don’t think about it at all.
Continue reading the main story
“I pulled the trigger,” he said. “You didn’t. Don’t take that away from me.”
The issue has been percolating for a few years, elucidated memorably in “Billy Lynn’s Long Halftime Walk,” a 2012 National Book Award finalist about a group of soldiers being feted at halftime of a Dallas Cowboys game. The soldiers express dread over people rushing to offer thanks, pregnant with obligation and blood lust and “their voices throbbing like lovers.”
The issue has also surfaced, at least tangentially, with Brian Williams’s admission that he’d exaggerated about being in a Chinook helicopter hit by enemy fire. In explaining his failed memory, the NBC News anchor said: “This was a bungled attempt by me to thank one special veteran and by extension our brave military men and women veterans everywhere, those who have served while I did not.”
Continue reading the main story
The idea of giving thanks while not participating themselves is one of the core vet quibbles, said Mr. Freedman, the Green Beret. The joke has become so prevalent, he said, that servicemen and women sometimes walk up to one another pretending to be “misty-eyed” and mockingly say “Thanks for your service.”
Mr. Freedman, 33, feels like the thanks “alleviates some of the civilian guilt,” adding: “They have no skin in the game with these wars. There’s no draft.”
No real opinions either, he said. “At least with Vietnam, people spit on you and you knew they had an opinion.”

“Thank you for your service,” he said, is almost the equivalent of “I haven’t thought about any of this.”
For most of us, I suspect, offering thanks reflects genuine appreciation — even if ill-defined. It was a dirty job and someone had to do it. If not these men and women, then us or our children.
Tim O’Brien, a Vietnam vet and the author of the acclaimed book “The Things They Carried,” told me that his war’s vets who believed in the mission like to be thanked. Others, himself included, find that “something in the stomach tumbles” from expressions of appreciation that are so disconnected from the “evil, nasty stuff you do in war.”
The more so, he said, “when your war turns out to have feet of clay” — whether fighting peasants in Vietnam or in the name of eradicating weapons of mass destruction that never materialized.

But doesn’t their sacrifice merit thanks? “Patriotic gloss,” responded Mr. O’Brien, an unofficial poet laureate of war who essentially elevates the issue to the philosophical; to him, we’re thanking without having the courage to ask whether the mission is even right.
It’s hard to assess how widespread such ideas are among the men and women of today’s generation. So, rather than try to sum up what invariably are many views on the subject, I’ll relate more of Mr. Garth’s story.
He grew up in Florida, son of a Vietnam vet, grandson of a decorated World War II vet, himself a bit of a class clown who drank his way out of college and wound up working the docks. The Marines offered a chance to make something of himself and, despite his parents’ pleadings otherwise, to fight.
It wasn’t what he romanticized. First training and waiting. Then the reality that he might die, along with his friends — 17 of them did, in action, by accident or by suicide. And, he now asks, for what?
His ideas about the need to prove himself slipped away, along with any patriotic fervor. He hates it when people dismiss the Taliban as imbeciles when he saw them as cunning warriors. To Mr. Garth, the war became solely about survival among brothers in arms.

Like that day in September 2011 when Mr. Garth was surrounded in the hut. A last-ditch call for help over the radio prompted a small group of fellow Marines to run three miles to save the day, one of them carrying 170 pounds of gear, including a 22-pound machine gun and 50 pounds of ammo.
THE thanks Mr. Garth gets today remind him of both the bad times and the good, all of which carry more meaning than he has now in civilian life. Hardest is the gratitude from parents of fallen comrades. “That’s the most painful thank you,” he said. “It’s not for me, and I’m not your son.”
He struggled to explain his irritation. “It’s not your fault,” he said of those thanking him. “But it’s not my fault either.”

So what to say to a vet? Maybe promise to vote next time, Mr. Freedman said, or offer a scholarship or job (as, he said, some places have stepped up and done). Stand up for what’s right, suggested Mr. O’Brien. Give $100 to a vet, Ben Fountain, author of the “Billy Lynn” book, half-joked, saying it would at least show some sacrifice on the thanker’s part.

Mr. Garth appreciates thanks from someone who makes an effort to invest in the relationship and experience. Or a fellow vet who gets it. Several weeks ago, he visited one of his soul mates from the mud hut firefight, which they refer to as the Battle of the Unmarked Compound. They drank Jameson whiskey in gulps.
“We cried in each other’s arms until we both could tell each other we loved each other,” Mr. Garth said. “We each said, thank you for what you’ve done for me.”
Matt Richtel is a reporter for The New York Times and the author, most recently, of the novel “The Doomsday Equation.”


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